Matt Damon Is Very Outspoken

I love Matt Damon and he has some good ideas.

You go Matt! Laura Bush says the media is only showing the bad in Iraq. So, she and the twins should fly over there, stroll the streets of Baghdad, do a little Christmas shopping, maybe have a capuccino in some nice sidewalk cafe.

Love him.

Way to go Matt. John Kerry said something similar and the Media and the Dems/Reps pounced. The situation in Iraq is only getting worse and many men and women of lower economic status are dying on a daily basis. The rich and upper middle class can afford to have their children educated. Lower income families see the military as a way of getting an education. However, with the situation in Iraq it is easier to get brought back in a body bag then to take advantage of the GI Bill. I hope that with the new Congress, our elected officials will take a more aggressive plan with Iraq whether downsizing or working with the UN and other countries in a more diplomatic solution. Something the United States should have done in the first place. However, with the insurgence rising, the United States is between a rock and a hard place.

So funny but so true. It’s always the elite and the rich who’s making the policy and decision while the son of the poor are sent to dead.

dean Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 9:49 am

^^^^
Thank you! I’m so sick of celebs and their political views. They should take a cue from Bono who doesn’t bash politicians, he works with them.

Matt’s an ass. The military is made up of volunteers, no one forced the wonderful men and women of the military to join. God forbid we ever need a draft to defend our country Matt himself would be called to go….does anyone think he’d do it? *******.

If there had been a military draft we NEVER would have gone into Iraq. Bush treated these wonderful brave men and women as if they were a bunch of toy soldiers for him to play war with.

Skinny Fat you are 100% right. of course Matt going to say that. He is a Demorcrat. I bet he wouldn’t be saying what he is saying if his own daughter and step daughter was of age.

Yes there are brave men and women in the military. However, I know many men and women in the military and believe me many joined for a variety of reason. Some people see it as a way of bettering themselves and getting an education. This is a fact. We are involved in a war that seems to have no end. The facts are men are dying for all the wrong reasons and many of the reasons we went to war in the first place have not exactly panned out. I wish all the men and women of the Armed forces the very best and hope that we can somehow find a resolution to the Iraq situation without causing more lives. To simply say it is a privilege and honor to serve is not enough. Our Men and women in the Armed Forces livelihood, dedication and service should be taken into account and deserve more than what they have gotten with this shoddy war. Just my humble opinion.

Here is yet another Hollywood moron who hasn’t educated himself before he opens his mouth. I like his films, but Matt is sooooooooo wrong on this. I read a story in Time or Newsweek the other day about how educated, smart, middle and upper class our military is. Be smart and research your ideas before you mouth off and sound like an idiot.

I am really tired of idiots spouting the opinions on the military. FACT-the military has a higher rate of college graduates than the general population.
This moron is obviously a devoted member of the Church of Michael Moore-he was the first to insist people “sign” their kids up for the war. What kind of retarded **** is that?? You don’t SIGN your kids up for the army-you enlist as an ADULT!! That is by far the most retarded argument I have ever heard. It doesn’t even make sense and yet I hear over and over again. Get a clue, people. These are not children forced by their parents to fight a war!!!!!!!!!
BTW-my husband is a Captain in the Military. And, FYI, Matt Damon and Jon Kerry, he has a masters degee.

If there is a draft I’m sure the Bushs will pull their famous “strings” so that the girls go but maybe cooking something somewhere SAFE.

Bravo!!

I have a whole new respect for Matt Damon. He speaks the truth. When there is no draft the military is built on the basis of class instead of mass. It is those from the lower economic classes who end up on the front lines and are ultimately more likely to come home in body bags. Enough is enough. If our government -Republican or Democrat really believes in the war, really believes in the mission then it must be willing to sacrifice the lives of its citizens and permanent residents from all economic and educational levels.

So, is Matt going to insist that his daughter and step daughter both enlist when they are of age? He is SO gungho on sending other peoples daughter.

Look at the Royal Family in England - both Wills and Harry are in the military and are set to go to the front line. You’d never see Bush’s daughters enlisting!!

Not every single person in America will agree in going to war. For him to suggest that both daugthers should go and join the military, we’ll they can if they want to because it is after all, still voluntary. You can’t force someone to join unless we are in dire need of it and that’s when the draft will come in effect.

There is more that can be done to win this war. The reason why it looks like we are losing is because we have our hands tied down. Also we got plenty of these “outspoken” celebs like Matt Damon or politicians who have their own agenda to get into the white house who have been against this war from the beginning. If everyone would just show support and not be such a ******* *******, we would have won this a long time ago. And yes, that includes the administration right now who are ***** handling this war! If only they could take into account how we defeated the Nazis granted our enemies are a bunch of cowards who hides behind the civilian population. Tactics needs to be changed and the Geneva convention need not apply to these cowards. Oh but guess who will be the first to apply the Geneva conventions on these cowards, we’ll the same outspoken cowards in hollywood and sold out politicians!

Yay Matt!

Bush was ridiculously cavalier about sending other people’s children to fight a war and in such a unilateral fashion! Bush totally thought he could avoid the U.N. process and that we still have the complete support of the rest of our “friends” like those of European countries with their support of troops and bases (i.e. sharing the cost of the war).

Instead Bush’s recklessness has gotten us into a Vietnam-scenario where we lose no matter what we do next!

If Bush had something personal to lose , like his own children going to war, he would have no reason to go to war with Iraq. He was quick on the whole unilateral decision– i.e. risking the lives of other people’s children, but his own? Never.

After all that is said and done, Bush’s legacy will be this Iraq fiasco.

Btw, everyone knows that it’s a voluntary military. However, it’s the economically disadvantaged that are the only ones who seriously consider it as a career option. i.e. they are the soldiers in the field.

Even the the rich kids who go to Westpoint or the other academies do not bear the brunt of war in the same way either.

Oh yeah and another thing, if anyone is under the illusion that there is even a slight difference between Republicans and Democrats they are sadly mistaken. In today’s world they each have the same agenda, to further the cause of the special interest groups who are padding their pockets. It all boils down to who is covering their a** the best while doing it!!!

I’m not American, so will probably know a lot less than most of you about your own army processes.
However, I think you are missing the point about what Damon is saying - that it is easy for leadership to send troops to war when their own loved ones won’t be at risk. Decisions may be made differently if the risk covered all.
And I think he realises that the army is voluntary - it’s just that more disadvantaged tend to enlist because of the opportunity it offers. Kids from richer backgrounds have greater choices/opportunities & may be therefore less inclined to enlist. However, that is a generalisation as there will always be very patriotic & selfless people who also enlist E.g that Canadian(?) pro-football player who was killed a couple of years ago.
I don’t think Damon is pro-war at all, so to suggest he wouldn’t want to send his own daughters is missing the ponit!

I beyond Matt Damon. I’d honestly rather watch him than Johnny Depp. I’m serious. He’s really good, and he acts with his eyes so much. He and Leonardo are tops on a short list of the the newer/younger actors IMO, and I totally agree with him that if all were considered, the move to push would not be so quick.

There was a time when the military was entered into voluntarily by all walks, but when the draft was instituted, more well healed than not tried hard to found officer positions for their sons and that’s simply the facts. When they couldn’t keep them completely out through various means, they made sure their time was done stateside, and George W. Bush was one of those that strings were pulled for.

I’m certain some wealthy democrates also did all they could to keep their sons out of it all together if they could. IMO Matt said, or NY congressman Rangle says is true. If all had to be considered, they wouldnt be so quick to go that route.

jpf

I commend all that readily enlist in the armed forces. Their willingness to tow the line is admirable but this war isn’t. We’re in Iraq under false pretenses. The war on terror would have been better fought in Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. We all know that. Sadaam was a bad guy but so is that loon in North Korea & the government of Darfar. Why are we not there? Say what you want about Kerry but if he were president, we wouldn’t be wasting time money and lives in Iraq. Thanks Matt for acknowledging that the emperor has no clothes and if this war hinged on the offsprings of the Bushes and Roves going to fight, there sure as hell wouldn’t be one. Think people, lack of support for Bush’s Iraq policy DOESN’T mean lack of support for the people who must carry it out.

Alright i have never posted on any thread but half you people are absolutely ridiculous. What matt said was completely valid, yes the army is voluntary,however, matt was contexting a hypothetical situation in which the draft would be started up again. If the draft is started again the first people who will be forced to war will be those of lower to middle class families. Fact! (im making fun of those people who said that so many times…idiots) review any war in which the draft was enacted you will discover that often those privileged children of the upper class will be able to dodge the draft (ie George Bush) because they have the ability to go to college (which eliminates you from being nominated from the draft) or because they have strong political and social connections. Thus, Matt is suggesting, and for good reason, that there exist a social and economic difference which exist between those who are drafted and those who remain in the States during times of war. Therefore, matt is making a valid point that if the draft is enacted we have to be concious of the fact that the poor will be picked to fight the rich man’s war…FACT! Furthermore, the majority of foot soldiers that are in the military, not the captains, not the generals, but the actual foot soldiers on the front line come from lower income families and DO NOT have a college degree and at the most have only a high school level of education! There are class levels that do exist in society and if you are apart of the upper levels you will have the security and confidence that you will never have to fight in any war ever. AND FURTHERMORE TO ALL YOU DAMN REPUBLICANS STOP SPITTIN YOUR DAMN MOUTH OF ABOUT THE “SCARED” LIBERAL. YOUR HOLY THAN THOU PRESIDENT AVOIDED THE DRAFT IN VIETNAM IN ORDER TO SNORT COKE AND DRINK HEAVILY IN COLLEGE SO DONT EVEN BEGIN TO SPEAK OF THE REPUBLICANS COMMITMENT TO COUNTRY…CAUSE ITS A LOAD.

yep still a republican that dodge it!

I salute the men and women who are in the armed services. They are defending a country and it’s values that treat them for the most part like trash. Way too many service men and women are underpaid and unappreciated for the work they do. An eye opener for me was finding out how many Navy families are on food stamps and still can’t make ends meet. They deserve better. Better housing, better pay and defintely better and safer uniforms and equipment. They also should be highly honored by all citizens and non citizens alike in this great country.

I’m glad to see so many people calling Matt out for his dumb comments. It’s nice to see so many people on here making sense. So if you guys are so smart about this, how come most of the people on here are pro-Brangelina?

effin….there is always the opportunity for lower rank personel to achieve higher rank.
I have a nephew who has been a grunt for over 10 yrs while he studied (curtesy of the USA) and finally received his commision..that he sought..
And that effin IS THE TRUTH!!

i HAPPEN TO LIKE MATT DAMON AS AN ENTERTAINER…I enjoy his films and find him very nice to look at, as well. I happen to know that he went to my school, Harvard..but did not graduate.
He is entitled to his opinion but I do not admire him painting the militarywith a broad brush. I would prefer that actors and singers keep their political thoughts to themselves…as inevitably..it is to the left of center…and anti everything. I find this boring…as if the Public cannot make up their own minds..without the actors leading us..ala George Clooney etc..Is their job so mindless that they strive to be taken seriously about something????

Very well said Matt!! Why should Bush with his family sitting there prettily and safely when some families are suffering because their brother, sister, father or husband are being killed unnecessarily for a very bad decision he made.

Jan, Thank you so much for posting. You spoke so clearly because you know from experience, you are so firmly entrenched in military life. I think the reason many are confused about what is and isn’t fact is they hear this kind of nonsense from someone they assume would not speak out in public so knowingly if they didn’t know what they were talking about. So…people hear him and assume he is right. I lived through the draft era in the late sixties and seventies. I said it then and I will say it now…we wouldn’t want our food cooked by people forced to cook it against their will. We wouldn’t want our hair cut by people who had no inclination or particular ability in that department but were forced to do it. Why, then, would it ever make any sense to force them to do something far, far more critical like defending our country? People , think! It was wrong then and it would be wrong now. Don’t jump on a bandwagon just because someone thinks they’re making a point! He is actually making an argument AGAINST a draft, which is as others here have said: the very people he thinks he is championing will be the people who will be forced into the military because they will not be in college! College, by the way, is NO LONGER just for the rich and privileged! It is for the determined. It is for the hard-working, perhaps, but it is available to anyone who wants to go and has graduated from High School. And High School is free and everyone has a right to go. Is is up to them to stay in, but once they have, there are so many ways to get a foot in the doors of colleges in this great country. I should know. I had ordinary grades in high school, but I stayed in school, graduated, started out at a local state school branch, applied for National Defense Loans to pay my own way(which I did by working summers and vacations) and I did it. I graduated from college! Raised in public housing in a very, very blue-collar town, and that was in the 60’s. Today it is almost easier to go to college if you ARE less- than- privileged, because there are so many programs not available to people with average or above average-incomes. Having said all that, what about the military as a calling? As an opportunity? What about the military as a step-up in the world for those who come from poverty and haven’t been offered guidance from parents or others? Do you know of any better way underachievers or underprivileged kids CAN step up otherwise? Can acquire discipline, order in their lives, focus on their futures? Can get health benefits, can get educated, can build a future based on the recognition and respect veterans receive in this wonderful country? I just don’t get what Matt sees as their options, otherwise. I think the opposite of Matt Damon.. I think it offers the quickest route to middle class for anyone below it, I think it should only be comprised of those who WANT to be soldiers, and I don’t want my country defended by anyone less than motivated and highly qualified to do so. Again Jan and others who wrote from the positions of experience, Thank You.

mel Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 4:12 pm
Wasn’t it a Democrat that started the draft for the Vietnam war??? I think so.

^^

I don’t know if it was or wasn’t but it’s not the point. The point is that those who have influence “no matter poltical party” wouldnt be so quick to declare war if their child met the requirements handed down by the government to serve in the military.

jpf

Jeff Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 3:30 pm
Just curious, when signing up for any branch of the military, on which page does say you won’t ever be expected to go to war?

^^^

You don’t seem to get it Jeff. This is about those who declare war. This is about the possibility of them taking a clearer view of what they’re signing off on if their child is destined to partipate. We weren’t attacked by the country we declared war on, and we DID declare war, and over 2500 sons and daughters have perished, and 3 times that have been injured in a war that may never have transpired if the sons and daughters of those of the privledge, the “fortunate sons,” were required to show up and do their time.

jpf

Em Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 7:10 pm

You missed the point. Matt would never have gone to war with Iraq. Bush declared war and lied to the American Public by saying there were WMD. Then when WMD wasn’t found, America was bringing democracy to Iraq. The PNAC documents were signed in 1998 by the Neocons. They tried to convince Clinton to go to war. They were hell bent on having a war and when 9/ll occurred they lied the American people into taking out Saddam. The American people bought for a while that there was some relation to what happened in NY and Saddam. That lie has finally been put to rest with the truth.

Perhaps if Bush had his daughters in this war, all that macho talk, all those lies, all that hype would have been dispensed with and the reality of life and death would have been more real to him.

The dead Americans are only a small part of this war. There are thousands dead in Iraq, there are millions of refugees and a civil war. The debt is in the billions and China holds our debt. We can’t do a thing against North Korea because China will pull the plug on our debt and we have no military to do a thing against Iran.

Matt Damon was so right.

MATT is HOT.

Grandma…”millions of refugees” where? “civil war” where? What debt does China hold that would place the United States in the position of not being able “to do a thing against North Korea”, and on what are you basing your position that “we have no military to do a thing against Iran”? Are these your assumptions and opinions or do you have specific facts? Are you doing what Matt is doing, which is speaking with authority about huge issues with no simple solutions as if he knows how to correct them? What should we do? If you know, let’s hear it.

Clinton received a lot of pressure from the Neocons to attack Iraq. They had fly overs during much of the last part of his administration. The Kurds were definitely part of this echo to do something to Saddam but the UN was on the ground and they did have Saddam in a box. David Kay tried very hard to get a little more time to halt this invasion and Scott Ritter was speaking out daily that there were no WMD. David Kay now tells the story of how Cheney was giving him GPS quadrants that were suppose to mark where the WMD was and it turned out the quadrants were in the ocean.

The aspirin factory was in Libia. Clinton bombed Libia not Iraq.

What a moron. There are more college educated people in the millitary than in Hollywood.

Vietnam was not dunped on Nixxon

He and his criminal agent Kissinger dumped it on themselves.

Ever hear of the orignal October Surprise? It isn’t widely known, much like the Oct ‘80 one isn’t either because both were clearly acts of high treason.

In Oct. ‘68, the Paris Peace talks were about to have a deal on the table. Such a deal would have no doubt cost Nixxon the upcoming election, an election he barely won as it was. Enter Nixon and Repig agent Henry Kissinger. Kissinger got a hold of S. Vietnamese puppet-prexy Thieu and convinced him he would get a much better deal than what was on the table and agreed upon in principle by both the North and the U.S. Thieu bought Kissinger’s B.S. and refused to go along. The result? 7 more years of war that would cost the lives of millions more South East Asians, expand into Cambodia leading to the “year-zero” insanity of Pol Pot and the lives of another 30,000 US Troops.

What was the deal that got derailed? Exactly the same one Nixxon accepted in January ‘73.

That such criminality can go unreported let alone unpunished is just one more arrow in America’s bad karma quiver. It is the whirlwind of History we shall soon be reaping in all its horror. A nation with so many monsters among its elite can not endure, and we won’t because the ruling elite is incapable of doing anything not in their immediate interests.

The crackpot lunatics we have in office now are not an aberration, they are the perfect representation of the insanity that infests the privileged and powerful sociopathic personalities that are the real powers behind the phony Democratic Republic state that is America. This isn’t a democracy anymore. They freaking eliminated Habeas Corpus. Do you know what that means?

I just adore the way you all have all the answers…its amazing that this nation has been able to get along without any of you and Matt Damon…None of you have ever seen what goes across Tony Blairs and GWs desk..and yet you KNOW what should be done…geez..how about you running next time. I am going to bed. This was supposed to be a blog about Matt Damon…and his insight into the problems of running Washington…his answer: send the girls.

jan Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 9:19 pm

Jan you know that is not what Matt Damon is saying. He is saying that maybe if you start an illegal war you should have a personal stake in the outcome.

And why don’t we know what is crossing GW’s desk. We should have transparency when going to war. George Bush lied, **** Cheney lied, Colin Powell lied and Condolessa Rice lied. Tony Blair lied too. What did they tell us? We know things that you don’t know and if you knew what we know, you would make the same decision. All of that was a lie. We should not have to wait four years after the mess is so bad that it can’t be fixed, to find out the truth.

You are a graduate of Harvard. At least debate honestly and don’t misread what Matt Damon said.

Grandma Says & Lyian
December 17th, 2006

Well said grandma & Lylian!

Obviously the rest of America knows what’s going as well and have an idea what’s crossing GW’s desk because we made sure to vote people into office who would provide a check and balance system, which will hopefully prevent any more of his asinine decisions.

However, I do not agree sending the twins, they would do more harm than good. It’s too hard to shoot straight when you either stoned or drunk out of your mind.

Don’t worry, the draft will be coming due to Congressman Charles Rangel. Matt is an American who’s point of view is a right that he enjoys as an American. Many people seem to want the United States to turn into some weird country where you can not criticise the leader. How un American is that? Those poeple can move to Cuba if they want a country where you can not talk about the President. The US is an IDEA that it’s people shall bow to no King or leader. He shall get called out like the common American Britney Spears flashing her hoo ha to the world. Those Bush twins are the worst examples of American young people and they are the Presiden’t children. And they are young women at that. Is it a wonder that Britney, paris, Lindsay and that lower class pack do what they do? If the Presidents children are falling down drunk and doing drugs, wouldn’t they be better off clean & sober and their bums in the military instead?

And what does anyone disagreeing with what Matt said has to do with being pro-Brangelina? They are a couple, not a political party. They don’t represent anything. They look good together and the fact that they have a mixed race family is just a reflection of the greater American society. And adopting is as old as time itself

a leader isn’t what it used to be. A leader must be just, have good morals, and be *trustworthy*.

dean Says:

“OH WOW Matt! What a concept! Send the US Presidents daughters off to war!”

…..”So what about YOUR own step daughter, Matty ole boy! I don’t hear you BOSTING that YOU will be waving HER off to fight on ….”

Dean, I think we missed what Mat’s saying as a whole. Aside from the poor fighting for the policy makers at the Capital ( the elite), I think what he is saying as well is that those who are in favor and voted for “it” should enlist and be there at the front line together with their family that supported it as well.

It’s nice to hear an artist that’ll speak out his mind and not be so worried about being hanged just because he’s going against the mighty power. This is one artist that that is not scared to practice “democracy.”

All respect to you, Matt Damon!

Jean Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 2:40 pm
“EXCELLENT POINT DAWSON!! How come Mattie did not mention Chelsea Clinton? She is the same age as the Bush twins and also a MAJOR party animal!! ”

Jean, is it because Chelsea”s daddy didn’t start the war and is against it?

# kidi Says:
December 17th, 2006 at 8:29 am

You go Matt! Laura Bush says the media is only showing the bad in Iraq. So, she and the twins should fly over there, stroll the streets of Baghdad, do a little Christmas shopping, maybe have a capuccino in some nice sidewalk cafe.

so true

sorry pushed the wrong button..anyways. NO ONE CLAIMED RESPONSIBILTY FOR 9/11. Though osama bin laden supported and congratuled those who carried it out he never claimed responsiblity. Thus, the reasons behind the execution of 9/11 are left unknown and it stands only as a spectacular action with no political purpose, ie it was not carried out by indiviudals hoping to project their cause in such an extreme manner in which people must responde to certain demands. 9/11 was not a cause for war it was a tragic event carried out through a few who were extremist not by a nation or a country.

Anyone who enlists KNOWS they may be sent to fight. The paperwork one signs makes it VERY VERY clear.

Many enlist in order to get a college education on the backs of the tax payers. There ARE other options. NO ONE is required to choose the military as one of those OPTIONS. This does not make those who choose this route under classed.

NOW……while the US citizens and politicans are busy arguing amongst ourselves, the Muslim extremists are busy invading a vast majority of the rest of the world through illegal immigration.

If you all want something to worry about, start listening to the President of Iran who openly states he plans to wipe the US off of the face of the earth. Read about what the illegal immigration of Muslims is doing to change the face and politics of the Netherlands and France and Germany and Belgium.

Look into the genocide that is happening in Darfur.

Here we sit worried about a draft or whether or not people are so underclassed they must join the military ……..all the while the Muslim extremeists are busy at their work ……their so called destinies …..of waging their jihads all over the world.

And if you think they HATE westerners because of Western Imperialism……you really should read up on why they feel called to duty.

In hind site, few people agree that invading Iraq was the best move to make, but we can’t turn back the clock. We are there and we must act as a “STRONG HORSE.” We need to stop the infighting and start to actually care about winning. We need to stop acting liking whiny spoiled brats.

Look around. Whether we want to believe it or not there is a WAR on Western Civilization. This war will not go away by us submitting to our enemies. America needs to wake up and see this war in Western Civilzation for what it is.

It doesn’t take much to figure it out. Our enemies are outright admitting they plan to wipe us off the face of the earth and don’t think they don’t MEAN it……

Read an effin book people! Says:
December 17th, 2006 at 3:49 pm
=====================

You sound seriously delusional. The decline of all the great Empires have been the arrogance of those in control, thinking they are superior and have a complete dominion
over “lesser” beings. Whether we were on good terms with Iraq at the time or not we do not have the “RIGHT” to tell others how to live unless people were in immediate danger. There are other, more productive strategies in combating terrorism. Violence always begat violence although in some cases I fully acknowledge that there are no other choices but war. We had choices in this situation and in my estimation made the wrong ones. I think the President and the Congress who voted to send our troops to Iraq owes them, their families and the American public an apology for deceiving us and putting our hard-working, faithful soldiers in harms way unnecessarily. I do understand that soldiers are prepared to give their life to their country. But we as citizens should value the lives of our troops who protect us and the country more than sending them to dangerous situations when we have not thought out the consequences of our actions. I agree that we have to do something to clean up our mess over there, because it is our mess. But the President seems to be incapable of coming up with a strategy. He should have realized that any middle-eastern intervention would always be rife with complexity. Just ask Israel and Palestine. You seriously need to re-think YOUR blind faith in the President. I for one am not willing to follow anyone blindly.

RAT Says:
December 18th, 2006 at 8:14 am

I like Matt Damon, he’s a good actor. But if he truly believes in what he is saying, why doesn’t he carry his ass over to Iraq to fight. Why don’t these actors think about what they are saying before they say it?
==========================

Why don’t you do the same?

==========================

My apologies to Read an effin book people! After re-reading several of the instances of posters above it is as I suspect. We all agree on certain parts of the debate about the War and military just not on the whole. You could even call this a microcism of how it is in the world at large. We have commonality of parts but not the whole.

We have extremist on each end with the majority of us being firmly in the middle, if not together. For Rabid pooch, rat, Jan and other extremists out there; muslim extremist/Israeli extremist/(Insert here Extremist), thinking of the world in terms of us against them is what starts most conflicts in the first place. The other cause of conflicts is poverty and dispowerment. This is a fertile breeding ground for extremist and terrorism. It is these things that we must foster, (understanding, prosperity and self-empowerment) in order to cut terrorism off at the knees. If these needs are not fulfilled then hatred, poverty, fundamental extremist and terrorism will continue to breed and consume the world.

I respect your viewpoint, me too…but, you are living in a popsickle land of enchantment…with fulfill their needs etc..I lived in a moslem country…and the only thing they want from you..is to get the hell out of their land and let them make your country muslim…they actually love things about America=blue jeans, cigarettes, girly mags, movies, make-up…but, on their terms. It is their religious duty to kill the infidel unless he converts. Period. You are in a Holy War whether you like it or not..and it will last many years..They have tried 3x to do this..and we are now in the 4th caliphate…and unless we send them back into the desert…they will continue until they win what they see as their duty to Allah…they are patient…
10 days, 10 week, 10 years, 100 yrs..whatever it takes..

I keep reading that this is “President Bushs’” war.

I wasn’t aware that a sitting US President could just go off on his own and start a war.

I wonder why it wasn’t voted on in congress?

jan Says:
December 18th, 2006 at 9:05 am
rabid pooch….you are the only blogger that “gets it”….
There are over 750 new mosques in this country funded by the Wahabi sect (home of the 9/11 terrorists). They are demanding prayer rooms in airports; microphoned calls to mecca equal to church bells pealing..to name a few intrusions..they are infiltrated the world..Europe is now called: Eurabia..France, Germany and England are inundated. English friends of mine in Birmingham told me they are not allowed to fly the English flag called ** George as it would offend the Muslims…and all of you bloggers that have all the answers………..
There is only one country that stands in the way….America..and that is why they are attacking us..they don’t hate us…they want you all to be Muslims…or die..simple..as a ABC…read the Koran.
They want to scare the world into submission…appeasement.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I really have to say something about this. STOP DEMONISING MUSLIMS. I have lived amongst muslims virtually all my life and some of my dearest friends are muslims. They are humans, just like you and me.

It is a tragedy of the muslim world that so many muslim countries, except those who have oil, are poor, corrupt and have a population which is largely illiterate. However, that doesn make Muslims all demonic. The poor education means that many have few means to access information, few tools to think through issues. They therefore are easily led. But really most muslims are just reaching.

What is the something they are reaching for?? Well, most muslims want to live in peace. They want what you want, money to spend, a nice home, good schools for their children, hospitals for the sick, a future for themselves and their children. And they want to see some sort of settlement in israel because Israel has become the symbol of the oppressor and the Palestinians the symbol of Muslim disenfranchisement in the world. America, as israels biggest supporter, also gets much of the blame from the muslim perspective.

so this is not a “war” that George Bush can ever win with arms. He has to win the hearts and minds of the average muslim. And the Israeli issue must be settled, together with Jerusalem. I absolutely support the right of israel to exists. I absolutely support the right of Palestine to exist as a viable state. And i absolutely think that if Jerusalem is the sticking point to the peace settlement as it has been, then Jerusalem needs to be made some sort of international territory. Simplistic, but a real start.

Having said the above, your point about bending over backwards to accommodate Muslims in countries such as the UK and France isn’t going to help. I don’t have a problem with the call to prayer (so long as there is a large muslim community surrounding the mosque and they dont use loud speakers) but I do have a problem with other things like muslim women wearing the burqa. I fully support the view that that should be banned. If I go to Saudi Arabia and I’m expected to wear the full burqa, I will do so, cheerfully, as I respect your customs. If you come to my country, then I expect to see your face, even if you cover the rest of your head and body. because in my country, to hide your face is sinister.

I also believe that Muslims have to question themselves more closely. They have to accept that there are aspect of their religion are totally reprehensible and contrary to the concept of Islam as a religion of conscience and peace, such as the crime of apostasy (ie a muslims converts to another religion) is in some countries, punishable by death. They have to ask themselves, what aspect of their religion, is keeping their own countries, backward, corrupt, illiterate. that’s not because of the western powers. One only has to look at Confucian/Buddhist based countries China, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Singapore, Hk and protestant based countries such as Scandinavia, Germany, Canada, Australia, etc and Catholic based countries such as those in South america, italy, spain etc, to see that there are cultural and religious values which keeps certain societies back ward and allow others move forward more rapidly.

Every society has to go through these sorts of soul searching. Just as you have demonised Muslims, so have muslims started to DEMONISE America. Instead of getting defensive, ask yourself instead why are muslims so angry with America, why do the muslims not like america. What happened? having lived in South East Asia most of my life, surronded by muslims, I can tell you that up until the late 1990s, America was looked up to and admired, by muslims and non muslims. Since the late 1990s, there’s been a sea change in the attitudes of most muslims and also non muslims, towards America. And not just in South East Asia but also in Europe. and this change is not positive towards America. Attitudes towards America have turned negative. Why is that. This is a question American must ask themselves or else America will be as boxed in as the muslims.

I’m not anti american. I have many American friends, worked with a great American MNC, been to america many times. I find Americans to be on the whole, sincere, genuinely non racist in the work place, generous. My best mentors are American. Most people still prefer to work for American companies because they know that in an American company, your race is less important then your performance. These are great things about America and Americans. In europe and America, it may be a bad thing to be an multinational but trust me, in Asia, most people prefer to work for an American MNC because the working conditions are better then the local ones.

However, george bush has squandered (yes, SQUANDERED) this bank account of goodwill built over the years by Americans who live abroad. I DONT LIKE GEORGE W BUSH, his unilateral ways (starting with Kyoto Agreement), his NEO cons, and I do think George Bush and his team wanted to see what they wanted to see and refused to acknowledge a different opinion about iraq and WMD. Consequently, they mis-led my country to participate in a war.

Now I know, George Bush ISNT America. That America is diverse. But just as you don’t distinguish between the fanatic muslim and the average muslim, then most people dont distinguish between American and its president. Yet, Jan, as a harvard graduate, please, make the emotional effort to make distinctions. Quite literally, world peace depends on people like you and me, making the distinctions so that we don’t throw out the baby with the bath water, so that we don’t tar a nation, or a religion, with the actions of a few fanatics, or even its democratically elected government.

But on the brighter note, I ADMIRE America, for having systems that prevented the Bush administration from manufacturing evidence of WMD in Iraq. If it were another country, it is very possible evidence could be manufactured.

I think America has many things going for it but from an international policy perspective, George bush and his neo cons have badly damaged America’s standing in the world.

OMG, I’ve never read such rubbish. Sure are a lot of know it alls on here that actually don’t know jack ****.

errrrrrrrrrr…….Christians have done their fair share of disgusting acts through out history was the point…..not haven’t.

RabidPooch Says:
December 18th, 2006 at 11:10 am
======================

The problem with your view is that these should be HUMAN RIGHTS issues
not simply targeting and profiling a particular RELIGION. HUMAN RIGHTS are violated by all countries and YES, even sanctioned and supported by various religions. The Roman Catholic church has yet to explain why it continually shields it’s priests, who are known pedophiles. These are acts which should be exposed for the CRIMINAL ACTS that they are, not used to target a particular religion. Am I to accuse all Catholists for letting this to happen? Or all Mormans for encouraging polygamy? These issues should be taken out of the religious realm and put into the realm of HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATIONS.

“Am I to accuse all Catholists for letting this to happen? Or all Mormans for encouraging polygamy?”

Mormons do not practice polygamy in this day and age. They would be excommunicated for doing so. A “fundamentalist” sect of the revised mormonism religion practices polygamy.

And you are confusing the issues. These are religious issues becasue they are tied to being a devout believer and following the rules of their religion by interpretation.

The priest molesting children is not a sanctioned practice of the Catholic church or interpretted to be a moral right because of Catholic teaching.

Honor killings are a sanctioned practice by fundamentalist followers of the Islamic faith.

And are moderates responsible for the actions of fundamentalists? Absolutely. The only difference between the moderate and a fundamentalist is that religious moderation is a prduct of secular knowledge and scriptural ignorance. The moderate of religion today has edited their beliefs with a modern understanding of ethics.

Let us be honest here. If Christians were following the letter of the law from the bible there would be more blood shed from them as well.

Read Deuteronomy 13:7. …..it tells you to KILL anyone who tells you to serve another God.

The difference is moderates and fundamentalists is the f undamentalists do not EDIT the ethics. They take their “books” at their words. The reason we have no many more Islamic fundamentalists is possibly two fold. The first is a general lack of overall education and the second is that unlike other religions, they have not had revivals (or basically formal updates) that have been encouraged and edited by modern thinking and ethics.

But know that because of moderates, fundamentalists of any religions survive more successfully.

In my mind this is absolutely NO acceptable reason to kill a human being over conflicts of religious beliefs, but the pratice has been and continues to thrive through out history.

I think Bush may have graduated from Yale but I can’t remember. Love Matt Damon. I really like the fact that he doesn’t get too involved in the Hollywood lifestyle. And in terms of war, most of them throughout human history are not justifiable. And killing certainly is not ever justifiable in my book. People need to learn to solve their problems without violence.

Hebrews were on the land in Israel before there was a group called Palestinians.
Jordan kicked the Palestinians out
Everyday peoples all over the world want to eat,sleep, love and be happy; Including Jews and Americans. The people in the Towers went to work one morning and never have been seen since. We have been at war a long time..and only realized it 9/11. The bombing of the Kobar Towers; the bombing of The USS Cole, the Spanish Subway; The London Subway, The recent London plot, Indonesian Nightclub, Israeli resorts, .etc. I could go on and on…
WE HAVE BEEN AT WAR A LONG TIME….if you refuse to believe it then that is your problem. If you continue to think that everyone is wonderful and loving then that is also your problem. The active terrorist groups laugh at our stupidity..and they count on the
Americans that don’t “get it”…BTW George W Bush graduated from Yale. History will deal with Iraq and who/what and when.
This blog started over Matt Damon…it would be nice if we could stick to the subject. I am over and out.

“You can never say too little if innocent people are going to be murdered in their own country.”….drainbreath…

9/11

okay……back to the topic……MATT DAMON IS WRONG.

the military often affords the average person opportunties they would not be able to otherwise afford.

case in point…..my brother in law…..he is considered “middle class,” served in the marines and recently spent a year in iraq flying helicopters in the reserves.

he saved his nickels to take flying lessons and get his pilot’s license, but had he not joined the military (and most recently been sent to iraq as a reservist) he would never have been afford the experience (the military paid for) to fly choppers (which he loves to do).

upon return he was also afforded the opportunity in a job flying helicopters at the border ………a job which is paying him $250 a week MORE than the the regular job he held prior to being deployed to iraq ($13,000 ADDITIONAL A YEAR !!!!).

you certainly don’t hear celebrities talking about the people’s lives who have been upgraded by serving their country. wonder why.

Just sayin’:

Not true. While some join out of a sense of duty, most do not. My brother is in the Navy because the boy could not get his life together. He needed the help of a structured environment. Many joined because a judge gave them a choice, jail or the military. Many joined for the free education. Many joined for the opportunity to climb out of poverty. A majority of enlisted personnel are there for reasons other than serving their country. You may not like hearing that, but the truth is not always pretty.

I think a lot of people on this board are not grasping the point Matt Damon is trying to make. He’s not bad mouthing the military. Not once does he say he doesn’t appreciate their sacrifice. He’s making the point that the decision-makers are the ones that do not appreciate their sacrifice. They send these poor men and women off to war paying them piss-poor salaries, they don’t give them suitable armour, and are now cutting their benefits. Nobody that cares about our military personnel would favor cutting taxes over properly arming our soldiers. Damon is merely stating that if more people had to pay the price for this war, then there probably wouldn’t have been one. And that includes more than just suiting up and going to Iraq. That means increasing taxes to properly fund the war. That means accepting sacrifices like rationing. That means Americans having to change their lifestyles (and that includes everyone, rich, middle class, and poor) to pay for the war. Bush embarrassed not only himself, but all of America when he suggested that everyone could help out by going shopping. His administration has absolutely no clue how to run and win a war. And that is why we’re destined to get our rear ends kicked in Iraq.

Traveler: Yes, it is true. Lived on a military base, married to a Marine, many, many military friends. MOST, if not ALL that we knew, were there out of duty and honor, thanks. And if the military is needed to straighten some out, then it is a good thing. Those young men and women come back with a sense of duty, pride, and honor, something they may never have felt without the military.

I stand by my position that an involuntary military is dangerous. Oh, and don’t get me started on females on the battlefied…Bush twins at war, please. Call me sexist if you wish (I am female by the way), I have many female friends in the military as well. They don’t belong on the battlefield.

Just Sayin’:

Why not? You state that most people in the military are there out of a sense of duty, why not females also? Don’t they have just as much a right to die for their country as a male? Just as much a right to fight for their country? I agree that not every woman could do it, just as not every man is suited to that job either. But there are women in this country that are excellent soldiers and can hold their own on the front lines. More so than most men. I don’t think we should be judging who can or cannot do a job. I’m a female mechanical engineer and I’m often judged as not being capable of doing the job because of my gender. I will not judge someone else the same way.

I thought we as a society had moved beyond silly gender-role stereo-typing.

Rabidpooch:

No, I don’t see Jews and Christians strapping bombs to their chests. I just see them wiping out entire villages of innocent people by dropping cluster bombs and daisy cutters while safely esconsed in their airplanes.

Read an effin book people! Says:

December 17th, 2006 at 4:14 pm
yep still a republican that dodge it!
*********************************************************************

To match your comment, how about the very famous Clinton? Where was he during all this? Wait, he never even put on a uniform. hmmmmm….

Sure, a lot of people join the military for a variety of reasons. But I’ll bet you if there were more job opportunities and cheaper college tuition you wouldn’t see so many fine young people betting their lives on making it out in one piece. People with money and options can do a lot better than jumping in the meat grinder.

I feel that’s why this war is dragging on and on….those in power don’t have a loved one dodging bullets. if they did, we’d have had this over and done with by now.

gosh! i LOVE that matt damon!

Clinton not only DIDN’T put on a uniform, he’s the one that knew of the possibly problems and sat back and did nothing. He was a coward and still is. And if they want to end the war, since that ugly ass kid of his over there and that face would scare the hell out of every evil person out there. Nuff said.

RabidPooch

You see, there are many misconceptions about Islam. Some of them are genuine misunderstandings. Others have been deliberately and maliciously spread so that people will get a false impression about what Islam is really like and you are on of the people who spread lies….

**Honor killings are a sanctioned practice by fundamentalist followers of the Islamic faith.***
^^
Where does it say in the Quran that about honor killing? show me show me and to the others.

Islam has a very proud history. If Muslims have acted in a less than perfect way, Islam itself has nothing to be ashamed of. Islam teaches respect for all religions. In fact, for Muslims, Abraham, David, Solomon, and Jesus are all prophets of Islam. All of them, according to Islam, taught the worship of one God. The greeting that Muslims give is “as-salamu `alaykum” (peace be upon you).

Islam doesn’t make non-muslim pray to Allah! THIS WHAT *Allah* says
*{Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in God hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And God heareth and knoweth all things}* (Al-Baqarah 2:256).

*{Say: “The Truth is from your Lord.” Let him who will believe, and let him who will, reject [it]}* (Al-Kahf 18:29).

I think Matt means that hi are against war. In us it’s a financial thing to voluntary and most people do it for the money. If you have a good education you will not fight I the frontline but maybe have a desk job! I love Matt and think hi is a nice guy and hi is not afraid to say things hi mean. Do you?

Somalian Says:
December 19th, 2006 at 1:04 am
RabidPooch

You see, there are many misconceptions about Islam. Some of them are genuine misunderstandings. Others have been deliberately and maliciously spread so that people will get a false impression about what Islam is really like and you are on of the people who spread lies….

**Honor killings are a sanctioned practice by fundamentalist followers of the Islamic faith.***
^^
Where does it say in the Quran that about honor killing? show me show me and to the others.

Islam has a very proud history. If Muslims have acted in a less than perfect way, Islam itself has nothing to be ashamed of. Islam teaches respect for all religions. In fact, for Muslims, Abraham, David, Solomon, and Jesus are all prophets of Islam. All of them, according to Islam, taught the worship of one God. The greeting that Muslims give is “as-salamu `alaykum” (peace be upon you).

Islam doesn’t make non-muslim pray to Allah! THIS WHAT *Allah* says
*{Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in God hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And God heareth and knoweth all things}* (Al-Baqarah 2:256).

*{Say: “The Truth is from your Lord.” Let him who will believe, and let him who will, reject [it]}* (Al-Kahf 18:29).

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Somalian, Rabid pooch, I understand what you are both saying. And I agree with the both of you. I have enough friends and other contact with muslims who live with their religion, gently and respectfully, of themselves, their women and others of different religions. Malay muslims whom I live with do not traditionally do honour killings. It is not known in the Malay community which encompasses malaysia and Indonesia. Many Malay muslims are as horrified as you are that honour killings, for example, take place in the name of Islam. It is a feudal tradition, not an Islamic tradition.

But it is up to people like you or Jan, who is educated in an Ivy League school, (harvard, no less) that accepts the best and brightest of a each generation of Americans and international people who must keep their eyes and hearts and minds focussed on the real truths. Truth, honour killings are a feudal aspect of Islam, it is not practised in Malaysia or Indonesia. Truth, Islam has successfully been embraced in several different cultures. Just like a spanish isnt an italian who isnt a german, who isnt and austrian. We must make those distinctions because our way forward is to point to examples of what is good and successful, not merely shout out what is obviiously reprehensible.

Somalian, I understand the view that Islam is a religion of conscience and peace. However, in many many muslim countries, the punishment of death for the crime of apostasy is simply inconsistent with the fundamental concept of islam as a religion of conscience and peace. Also, many of the actions which are perpertrated in the name of Islam, but which are not part of Islam, must be refuted by people like yourselves. You are not apologising, you are explaining and you need to explain this not just to non muslims but also to the ummah. As an educated Muslim, that is your responsibility.

Our responsibility as non muslim is to strive to listen with an open heart and mind and to work to find solutions. Because one thing we can all say, whether you call it a clash of civilisation or ideals, we cannot survive it. We must find tolerant solutions.

Ahhh…..but the part you forget to mention lylian is that on almost EVERY page, the Koran instructs observant Muslims to despise nonbelievers.

On almost every page it prepares the ground for religious conflict.

I am list quote after quote after quote……but I don’t think we need to go there.

Here is some elaboration from a hadith:

Jihad is your duty under any ruler, be he godly or wicked.

A single endeavor in Allah’s cause in the forenoon or in the afternoon on the frontier is better than a month of fasting and prayer.

Nobody who dies and finds good from Allah would wish to come back to this world even if she were given the whole world and whatever is in it, except the martyr who, on seeing the superiority of martyrdom, would like to come back to the world and get killed again.

He who dies without having taken part in the campaign dies in a kind of unbelief.

Paradise is in the shadows of swords …

***********
Wow ….. so much for Islam being a religion of peace.

The basic thrust of the Islamic religion is:

convert, subjugate, or kill unbelievers; kill apostates; and conquer the world.

Don’t try to hide behind the religion of peace thing. Jihad, which is a war against infidels and is central feature of the Islamic faith. THAT is why the “moderate” Muslims refuse to speak out against the killing of innocents.

RabidPooch

I am list quote after quote after quote……but I don’t think we need to go there.

Here is some elaboration from a hadith:

Jihad is your duty under any ruler, be he godly or wicked.

A single endeavor in Allah’s cause in the forenoon or in the afternoon on the frontier is better than a month of fasting and prayer.

Nobody who dies and finds good from Allah would wish to come back to this world even if she were given the whole world and whatever is in it, except the martyr who, on seeing the superiority of martyrdom, would like to come back to the world and get killed again.

He who dies without having taken part in the campaign dies in a kind of unbelief.

Paradise is in the shadows of swords …

what hadith are you talking about?

RabidPooch
&
lylian Say

Take care and have a good day.

“what hadith are you talking about?”

Hadith 4:52

Here is some more FOOD FOR THOUGHT …..

“Let’s condone rape first:

Ishaq:512 “The Apostle prohibited four things the morning of the Khaybar raid: carnal intercourse with pregnant women who were captured, mingling his seed with another man’s.

Since we’re talking about war, let’s approve plunder also:

Qur’an 8:69 “So enjoy what you took as booty; the spoils are lawful and good.”

Now we’re getting there. Endorse fighting, and everyone gets glorious rewards:

4th surah:
“Those who barter their life in this world for the next should fight in the way of Allah; whether he is killed or victorious, a glorious reward awaits.” “Urge the believers to fight…to keep back the might of the Infidels.” “Seize them and kill them wherever they are.” “Muslims who sit idle are not equal to those who fight in Allah’s Cause with their wealth and lives. Allah has exalted those who fight for Islam.”

Anyone calling Islam a ‘Religion of Peace’ should read this:

Ishaq:587 “Our onslaught will not be a weak faltering affair. We shall fight as long as we live. We will fight until you turn to Islam, humbly seeking refuge. We will fight not caring whom we meet. We will fight whether we destroy ancient holdings or newly gotten gains. We have mutilated every opponent. We have driven them violently before us at the command of Allah and Islam. We will fight until our religion is established. And we will plunder them, for they must suffer disgrace.”

Suicidal fighting pleases the prophet:

Ishaq:300/ Tabari VII:56 “‘O Messenger of Allah, what makes the Lord laugh with joy at his servant?’ He replied, ‘When he plunges his hand into the midst of an enemy without armor.’ So Auf took off the coat of mail he was wearing and threw it away. Then he took his sword and fought the enemy until he was killed.”

Here’s something for peaceful Muslims:

Quran 61:10 “Believers, shall I lead you to a bargain or trade that will save you from a painful torment? That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad), and that you strive and fight in the Cause of Allah with your property and your lives: That will be best for you, if you but knew!”

Martyrdom rewards are listed here:

Quran 61:12 “He will forgive you your sins, and admit you to Gardens under which rivers flow, and to beautiful mansions in Eden: that is indeed the Supreme Achievement. And another (favor) which you love: help from Allah for a speedy victory over your enemies.”

Again, death is irrelevant:

Quran 3:169 “Think not of those who are slain in Allah’s Cause as dead. Nay, they live, finding provision from their Lord.”

“Jubilant in the bounty provided by Allah: and with regard to those left behind, who have not yet joined them (in their bliss), the Martyrs glory in the fact that on them is no fear, nor have they cause to grieve. Allah will not waste the reward of the believers.”

Some fighters already died, others are waiting to:

Quran 33:22 “When the Believers saw the clan’s forces, they said: ‘This is what Allah and his Messenger promised us.’ It added to their faith, obedience, and submission. Among the Believers are men who have been true to their covenant with Allah (and have gone out for Jihad (holy fighting)). Some have completed their vow to extreme (and have been martyred) fighting and dying in His Cause, and some are waiting, prepared for death in battle.”

Win-win situation, Muhammad claims. Martyrs rely on these words:

Quran 4:74 “Let those who fight in Allah’s Cause sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fights in the Cause of Allah, whether he is slain or gets victory—We shall give him a great reward.”

Again, fighting is better than anything this world has to offer:

Bukhari:V4B52N50 “The Prophet said, ‘A single endeavor of fighting in Allah’s Cause in the forenoon or in the afternoon is better than the world and whatever is in it.’”

Let’s make the win-win situation completely clear. If Muhammad is trustworthy, that is:

Bukhari:V4B52N46 “I heard Allah’s Apostle saying, ‘Allah guarantees that He will admit the Mujahid in His Cause into Paradise if he is killed, otherwise He will return him to his home safely with rewards and war booty.’”

Suicidal fighting endorsed again:

Tabari VIII:153/Ishaq:533 “Abdallah Rawahah encouraged the men, saying, ‘By Allah, what you loathe is the very thing you came out to seek—martyrdom. We are not fighting the enemy with number, strength, or multitude, but we are fighting them with this religion with which Allah has honored us. So come on! Both prospects are fine: victory or martyrdom.’ So they went forward.”

Since death in Allah’s Cause is so great, how about we repeat it? This religion loves death:

Bukhari:V4B52N53 “The Prophet said, ‘Nobody who dies and finds Paradise would wish to come back to this life even if he were given the whole world and whatever is in it, except the martyr who, on seeing the superiority of martyrdom, would like to come back to get killed again in Allah’s Cause.’”

This is simple. A good Muslim fights with all he has:

Bukhari:V4B52N45 “Someone asked, ‘Allah’s Apostle, who is the best among the people?’He replied, ‘A believer who strives his utmost in Allah’s Cause with his life and property.’”

Finally, let’s take something the translator added in the Noble Quran (the official Saudi translation):

Noble Qur’an 2:190 Footnote: “Jihad is holy fighting in Allah’s Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established, Allah’s Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite.”

Noble Qur’an 2:190 Footnote: “Jihad is holy fighting in Allah’s Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established, Allah’s Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite.”

Jihad is one of the pilliars of islam?
^^
Wrong,Jihad is NOT one of the pilliars of islam

Pilliars of islam is:

1.Ash-Shahaadah…
…the testimony that there is no deity but Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.
The Prerequisites of the Declaration of Faith

2.As-Salaat…
…the ordained prayers based on the Qur’an and the Sunnah.

3.Az-Zakaat…
…the obligatory purification tax on the wealthy.

4.As-Sawm…
…the abstinence from evil deeds and talk, all food and drink.

5.Al-Hajj…
…the pilgrimmage during the month of Dhul-Hijjah to the first place of worship on earth, the Ka’bah
*****************************************************
“Let’s condone rape first:

Ishaq:512 “The Apostle prohibited four things the morning of the Khaybar raid: carnal intercourse with pregnant women who were captured, mingling his seed with another man’s.

what the Hell! are you for real? lies on top of lies….

Lets talk about jihad which you love to bring up over and over again

Here’s something for peaceful Muslims:

Quran 61:10 “Believers, shall I lead you to a bargain or trade that will save you from a painful torment? That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad), and that you strive and fight in the Cause of Allah with your property and your lives: That will be best for you, if you but knew!”

^^^
WORNG SO WRONG, well well carefull man don’t lie to much….
Allah(swt) the most HIGH doesn’t bargain or trade with his creation and it doesn’t say that it says and next time use the whole surat.

[61.1] Whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth declares the glory of Allah; and He is the Mighty, the Wise.
[61.2] O you who believe! why do you say that which you do not do?
[61.3] It is most hateful to Allah that you should say that which you do not do.
[61.4] Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way in ranks as if they were a firm and compact wall.
[61.5] And when Musa said to his people: O my people! why do you give me trouble? And you know indeed that I am Allah’s apostle to you; but when they turned aside, Allah made their hearts turn aside, and Allah does not guide the transgressing people.
[61.6] And when Isa son of Marium said: O children of Israel! surely I am the apostle of Allah to you, verifying that which is before me of the Taurat and giving the good news of an Apostle who will come after me, his name being Ahmad, but when he came to them with clear arguments they said: This is clear magic.
[61.7] And who is more unjust than he who forges a lie against Allah and he is invited to Islam, and Allah does not guide the unjust people.
[61.8] They desire to put out the light of Allah with their mouths but Allah will perfect His light, though the unbelievers may be averse.
[61.9] He it is Who sent His Apostle with the guidance and the true religion, that He may make it overcome the religions, all of them, though the polytheists may be averse.
[61.10] O you who believe! shall I lead you to a merchandise which may deliver you from a painful chastisement?
[61.11] You shall believe in Allah and H,is Apostle, and struggle hard in Allah’s way with your property and your lives; that is better for you, did you but know!
[61.12] He will forgive you your faults and cause you to enter into gardens, beneath which rivers flow, and goodly dwellings in gardens of perpetuity; that is the mighty achievement;
[61.13] And yet another (blessing) that you love: help from Allah and a victory near at hand; and give good news to the believers.
[61.14] O you who believe! be helpers (in the cause) of Allah, as~ Isa son of Marium said to (his) disciples: Who are my helpers in the cause of Allah? The disciples said: We are helpers (in the cause) of Allah. So a party of the children of Israel believed and another party disbelieved; then We aided those who believed against their enemy, and they became uppermost.
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Quran 3:169 “Think not of those who are slain in Allah’s Cause as dead. Nay, they live, finding provision from their Lord.”

“Jubilant in the bounty provided by Allah: and with regard to those left behind, who have not yet joined them (in their bliss), the Martyrs glory in the fact that on them is no fear, nor have they cause to grieve. Allah will not waste the reward of the believers.”

Once again stop making words up and tell the it like it is.
^^^^^^
[3.167] And that He might know the hypocrites; and it was said to them: Come, fight in Allah’s way, or defend yourselves. They said: If we knew fighting, we would certainly have followed you. They were on that day much nearer to unbelief than to belief. They say with their mouths what is not in their hearts, and Allah best knows what they conceal.
[3.168] Those who said of their brethren whilst they (themselves) held back: Had they obeyed us, they would not have been killed. Say: Then avert death from yourselves if you speak the truth.
[3.169] And reckon not those who are killed in Allah’s way as dead; nay, they are alive (and) are provided sustenance from their Lord;
[3.170] Rejoicing in what Allah has given them out of His grace and they rejoice for the sake of those who, (being left) behind them, have not yet joined them, that they shall have no fear, nor shall they grieve.
[3.171] They rejoice on account of favor from Allah and (His) grace, and that Allah will not waste the reward of the believers.
[3.172] (As for) those who responded (at Ohud) to the call of Allah and the Apostle after the wound had befallen them, those among them who do good (to others) and guard (against evil)shall have a great reward.
[3.173] Those to whom the people said: Surely men have gathered against you, therefore fear them, but this increased their faith, and they said: Allah is sufficient for us and most excellent is the Protector.
[3.174] So they returned with favor from Allah and (His) grace, no evil touched them and they followed the pleasure of Allah; and Allah is the Lord of mighty grace.
[3.175] It is only the Shaitan that causes you to fear from his friends, but do not fear them, and fear Me if you are believers.
[3.176] And let not those grieve you who fall into unbelief hastily; surely they can do no harm to Allah at all; Allah intends that He should not give them any portion in the hereafter, and they shall have a grievous chastisement.
[3.177] Surely those who have bought unbelief at the price of faith shall do no harm at all to Allah, and they shall have a painful chastisement.
[3.178] And let not those who disbelieve think that Our granting them respite is better for their souls; We grant them respite only that they may add to their sins; and they shall have a disgraceful chastisement.
[3.179] On no account will Allah leave the believers in the condition which you are in until He separates the evil from the good; nor is Allah going to make you acquainted with the unseen, but Allah chooses of His apostles whom He pleases; therefore believe in Allah and His apostles; and if you believe and guard (against evil), then you shall have a great reward.

Noble Qur’an 2:190 Footnote: “Jihad is holy fighting in Allah’s Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established, Allah’s Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite.”
^^

The teaching of Islam is different from both these teachings. It strikes a mean between the two. Islam does not teach aggression as did Moses. Nor does it, like present-day (and presumably corrupt) Christianity, preach a contradiction. It does not ask us to turn the other cheek and at the same time to sell our clothes to buy a sword. The teaching of Islam fits into the natural instincts of man, and promotes peace in the only possible way.

Islam forbids aggression, but it urges us to fight if failure to fight jeopardizes peace and promotes war. If failure to fight means the extirpation of free belief and of the search of truth, it is our duty to fight. This is the teaching on which peace can ultimately be built, and this is the teaching on which the Prophet based his own policies and his practice. The Prophet suffered continuously and consistently at Mecca but did not fight the aggression of which he was an innocent victim. When he escaped to Medina, the enemy was out to extirpate Islam; it was, therefore, necessary to fight the enemy in defense of truth and freedom of belief.

We quote below the passages in the Quran which bear on the subject of war.

(1) In 22:40-42 we have:

Permission to fight is given to those against whom war is made, because they have been wronged-and Allah indeed has power to help them-Those who have been driven out from their homes unjustly only because they said, “Our Lord is Allah”-And if Allah did not repel some men by means of others, there would surely have been pulled down cloisters and churches and synagogues and mosques, wherein the name of Allah is oft commemorated. And Allah will surely help one who helps Him. Allah is indeed Powerful, Mighty.-Those who, if We establish them in the earth, will observe Prayer and pay the Zakat and enjoin good and forbid evil. And with Allah rests the final issue of all affairs.
The verse purports to say that permission to fight is given to the victims of aggression. God is well able to help the victims-those who have been driven out of their homes because of their beliefs. The permission is wise because, if God were not to repel the cruel with the help of the righteous, there would be no freedom of faith and worship in the world. God must help those who help to establish freedom of worship. It follows that fighting is permitted when a people have suffered long from wanton aggression-when the aggressor has had no cause for aggression and he seeks to interfere with the religion of his victim. The duty of the victim, if and when he attains to power, is to establish religious freedom and to protect all religions and all religious places. His power is to be used not for his own glorification, but for the care of the poor, the progress of the country and the general promotion of peace. This teaching is as unexceptionable as it is clear and precise. It proclaims the fact that early Muslims took to war because they were constrained to do so. Aggressive wars were forbidden by Islam. Muslims are promised political power, but are warned that this power must be used not for self-aggrandizement, but for the amelioration of the poor and the promotion of peace and progress.

(2) In (2:191-194) we have:

And fight in the cause of Allah against those who fight against you, but do not transgress. Surely, Allah loves not transgressors. And kill them wherever you meet them and drive them out from where they have driven you out; for persecution is worse than killing. And fight them not in, and near, the Sacred Mosque until they fight you, then fight them: such is the requital for the disbelievers. But if they desist, then surely Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful. And fight them until there is no persecution, and religion is professed for Allah. But if they desist, then remember that no hostility is allowed except against the aggressors.
Fighting is to be for the sake of God, not for our own sake or out of anger or aggrandizement, and even fighting is to be free from excesses, for excesses are displeasing to God. Fighting is between parties of combatants. Assaults on individuals are forbidden. Aggression against a religion is to be met by active resistance, for such aggression is worse than bloodshed. Muslims are not to fight near the Sacred Mosque, unless an attack is first made by the enemy. Fighting near the Sacred Mosque interferes with the public right of pilgrimage. But if the enemy attacks, Muslims are free to reply, this being the just reward of aggression. But if the enemy desists, Muslims must desist also, and forgive and forget the past. Fighting is to continue so long as religious persecution lasts and religious freedom is not established. Religion is for God. The use of force or pressure in religion is wrong. If the Kafirs desist from it and make religion free, Muslims are to desist from fighting the Kafirs. Arms are to be taken up against those who commit excesses. When excesses cease, fighting must cease also.

Muslim teaching, however, does not consist only of precepts laid down in the Quran. It also includes the precepts and example of the Prophet. What he did or what he taught in concrete situations is also an essential part of the Islamic teaching. We append here some sayings of the Prophet on the subject of war and peace.

Muslims are forbidden altogether to mutilate the dead (Muslim).

Muslims are forbidden to resort to cheating (Muslim).

Children are not to be killed, nor women (Muslim).

Priests and religious functionaries and religious leaders are not to be interfered with (Ôaªavi).

The old and decrepit and women and children are not to be killed. The possibility of peace should always be kept in view (Abu Dawud).

When Muslims enter enemy territory, they should not strike terror into the general population. They should permit no ill-treatment of common folk (Muslim).

A Muslim army should not camp in a place where it causes inconvenience to the general public. When it marches it should take care not to block the road nor cause discomfort to other wayfarers.

No disfigurement of face is to be permitted (Bukhari and Muslim).

The least possible losses should be inflicted upon the enemy (Abu Dawud).

When prisoners of war are put under guard, those closely related should be placed together (Abu Dawud).

Prisoners should live in comfort. Muslims should care more for the comfort of their prisoners than for their own (Tirmidhi).

Emissaries and delegates from other countries should be held in great respect. Any mistakes or discourtesies they commit should be ignored (Abu Dawud, Kitab al-Jihad).

If a Muslim commits the sin of ill-treating a prisoner of war, atonement is to be made by releasing the prisoner without ransom.

When a Muslim takes charge of a prisoner of war, the latter is to be fed and clothed in the same way as the Muslim himself (Bukhari).
The Holy Prophet was so insistent on these rules for a fighting army that he declared that whoever did not observe these rules, would fight not for God but for his own mean self (Abu Dawud).

Abu Bakr, the First Khalifa of Islam, supplemented these commands of the Prophet by some of his own. One of these commands appended here also constitutes part of the Muslim teaching:

Public buildings and fruit-bearing trees (and food crops) are not to be damaged.

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This is the end of the line for me, RabidPooch has major prejudices in his heart and it’s blackend by it. Roger Bacon the philosopher who rightly said: “IT IS EASIER FOR A MAN TO BURN DOWN HIS OWN HOUSE THAN TO GET RID OF HIS PREJUDICES”.

A man/woman cannot merely live on planet earth by his wits or instincts alone, he needs divine guidance that the Merciful Allah (God) provides by way of divine books and role models called Prophets or Messengers.

From the very day that man took his first step on mother earth, he was shown the WAY, the LIGHT, and the TRUTH. The reason being the first man on earth was also the first prophet of Allah. Man was not abandon by Allah on earth as some philosophers believe, but took a great leap forward on earth where he was given the free will to choose Allah’s way or another.

Man/woman is at his best when he exercises his choice in submission to Allah’s will or way. Choosing a path or way opposite to what God has shown by way of His prophets, man puts himself in peril, anguish and doom.

Have you lost your way in life and are searching for a way out of your misery, innate unhappiness, and a way back to a natural way of life? How do I find my way back to the One and Only True God? May be a question perplexing you.

Upper most in your mind would be the question where do I begin my search?

The right place to start looking is in the Glorious Qur’an, God’s Last Testament to mankind. No other book supplied to so many and over so long a span of time, a comprehensive answer to the question, “How shall I behave in order to achieve the good life in this world and happiness in the life to come?”

The Qur’an which was revealed to Prophet Muhammad over a period of 23 years through the Angel Gabriel manifests God’s grace to man,
the ultimate wisdom, and ultimate beauty of expression. In short, the true Word of God.

The Qura’n presents to man a complete and comprehensive way of life, and teaches that all life should be lived in obedience to God, and not partly to God and partly to Caesar. The Qura’nic thesis is that all life, being God-driven, is a unity and that problems of the flesh and of the mind, of sex and economics, of individual righteousness and social equity are intimately connected with man’s hopes of salvation and life after death.

The Qur’an teaches that man is born sinless and pure. He is not held accountable for any wrongs the first man and woman on earth have committed. No man shall bear the burden of another. No one died or dies for your sins, particularly those that you are not guilty off or pays the price for you to get you off the hook. As magnanimous as vicarious atonement may sound, blood sacrifices are not natural, humane, religious or Godly. According to the Qur’an man is accountable for his own deeds or misdeeds and it is only the Almighty God in His infinite Mercy who can forgive man for transgressing against himself, others, his society, and God’s guidance to him.

The Qur’an also teaches that every person is born a Muslim. All the prophets that Allah sent as teachers and role models to humanity were also Muslims. This is all the more necessary to understand, as the terms “Islam and Muslim” have unfortunately attained a restricted, historically circumscribed significance as applying exclusively to a particular community and people. It should however be borne in mind that when the contemporaries of the prophet Muhummed heard these terms, they understood them as denoting man’s “self-surrender” to God without limiting these terms to any specific community or denomination. For example in 3:67 where Abraham is spoken of as having “surrendered himself to God”, or in 3:52, where the disciples of Jesus say, “Bear thou witness that we have surrended ourselves unto God” (Bi-Anna Muslimun) In Arabic, this original meaning has remained unimpaired and no Arab scholar has ever become oblivious of the wide connotation of these terms.

The Qur’an enlightens us that the Almighty God sent His prophets with the message of Islam to humanity. Each and every prophet brought the same message, which was Islam, for its own time and place.
Islam means peace or submission to the will or way of God.

It is a misnomer to belief that Islam is a new religion. The Qur’an is God’s final testament to humanity and the fulfilment of His grace, mercy, and bounty that He sent His final messenger Prophet Muhammad as a mercy unto all creatures. Prophet Muhammad was the last of the divine Prophets sent to mankind that began with Prophet Adam, the first man on earth.

Are you in search of the truth? Do you want to acquire a sense of peace? Are you looking for a winning lifestyle? Have you found the way that will bring you closer to God and which will lead you to a win/win situation both in this life and the eternal life to come?

The Qur’an is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIGHT. The proof of the Qur’an is in its own beauty and nature, and the circumstances in which it was promulgated. The world is challenged to produce a book like it and has not produced one in 1400 years. It is the only revealed book whose text stands pure and uncorrupted today. Read It! It will change your life for the better and forever in a way that will bring you the much needed happiness, peace, salvation, and above all the pleasure and bounty of God and the fulfilment of God’s promise of a trouble free life without end.

One last time:

2-256: Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth stands out clear from error; whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.

Dear RabidPooch rather than inviting people to Islam or Christianity, let us first invite people to honesty, ethics, morality, truthfulness, justice, and the right for people to choose their own faith without coercion or distortion.If we can achieve this, then it does not matter if I am a Christian, a Jew, a Hindu or a Muslim for the world would then indeed be a peaceful and loving world to live in. Don’t you agree ? May God Guide us all to the path of Truth, Peace and Justice.